eccentricflower.com - hand-coded since 1993 - some content not suitable for all audiences
Always Read the Warnings
If you scroll past them, it still counts as having read them.
Material on this site may contain explicit scenes of (or discussion of) people having sex or engaging in kinky/fetishistic behavior, including fantasy content which would not be acceptable in the real world.
If you don't think you're adult enough to be able to handle that, then you're not; go away.
If you don't think such material should be available to anyone, go to hell.
I made all this stuff; I own it. Copyright is definitely claimed. Do not use it without permission.
Do not steal it. Especially do not steal it and alter it and claim it's now yours.
Do not steal it. Especially do not steal it and alter it and claim it's now yours.
Technically, that includes you downloading a copy to your own computer, but I can't stop you from that.
Just ... keep it to yourself, OK? If you want other people to see it, send them here.
Just ... keep it to yourself, OK? If you want other people to see it, send them here.
The majority of this material is not mobile-friendly and it's not ever going to be.
The image at the top of the page is there on purpose. If you can't see all of it without needing a horizontal scrollbar, then you're going to have real trouble with most of the stories below. Some things aren't built for a tiny screen.
OK! Now we can get to the good stuff. Each section below is newest at top so you don't have to scroll as far.
But it's still a very long page, so here are some section links. You're welcome.
Sleeper Squad
Here is the current standard "NEW TO SLEEPER SQUAD?" block I put on the AO3 posts:
Best thing is always to begin at the beginning, but that's a lot, so here's the minimum you need: Our heroes Ruby and Leyna, and newcomer Jex, and their assortment of friends, lovers, allies, and enemies, all live their lives in Sleep, which is a virtual reality ... though they don't think of it that way. There are several very large Sleep complexes throughout the world -- cities, really -- and the one they live in is called A4.
All of these complexes, and pretty much everything else in the world worth owning, are controlled by the Barker family. Barkers are not always the greatest people in the world, but some of them have their moments. Leyna is a Barker, the daughter of Serene, but that was a secret for a long time, and Leyna's ambivalent about it.
Ruby and Leyna and their team deal with issues of unwanted manipulation. The "reality" of Sleep is easily altered, which is not itself a problem, but it is when people manage to impose those alterations on other people without their consent.
At the end of #29, A4 was infected with the Sprue, which led to the place fracturing into a number of different blocks with wildly different habits and appearances. Our heroes are based in Serenity, which is a pretty nice place, but some of the other blocks are not so nice, and sometimes Ruby and Leyna and their team are asked to intervene in those -- for example, to rescue someone who doesn't want to be trapped in them. As of #42, the Sprue has apparently been dealt with, but the fracturing remains.
... and if you think that's A Lot, you are not ready for the sheer mountain of backstory in this soap opera of lives and loves and heroes and villains and Weird Shit. Seriously, I know the backstory levels are daunting -- you should see my notes! -- and I have marked a couple of places which might be good starting points if you don't want to start all the way at the beginning. Also, starting with issue #30 I have tried to always explain who a character is we haven't seen in a while, and recap plotlines we're picking up after a long pause. But I can't stop to explain everything. There's too much of it.
CONTENT NOTE: Sleeper Squad is rarely my filthiest material, but because these stories have a separate audience on DA who get disappointed if an issue doesn't have fun and games, there is almost always some sex or kink (or kinky sex) in each story. Also, because anything can happen in Sleep, Sleeper Squad contains all of my weirdest physical transformations (so far!)
We go to Spindrop at last. Somewhat flawed due to difficulty depicting action/motion, but fun is had nonetheless.
Some scenes in this are not nearly as gross as I wanted them to be.
Mostly the Highpoint plotline.
It's a Yards story! You know what that means: it's a long one.
All you ever wanted: sex dolls, robots, and bananas.
See the comment below at #40.
See the comment below at #40.
#40, #41, and #42 are a three-part story you don't want to start in the middle of. As the dates show, these three were really all done in one long bout ... and when I was finished, I was so exhausted that I didn't go back to Sleeper Squad for nearly two months. These are the culmination of the Sprue plotline.
Among other things, we begin a long-running Cobbles plotline.
The second major dose of Highpoint plotline.
Yards stories tend to be long. Here we get to the bottom of the mess in the swamp.
The issue that will have you asking "Exactly how many Janice Grells are there?"
On DA this is called "the one with the clowns."
Century, the last major zone of post-Sprue A4 we hadn't visited yet. Lots of robots.
In which we visit the Cobbles, where the rules are a little different.
Jex pays her first visit to the Yards (as do we).
In which we spend a night wandering the Souk and encountering various weirdness.
At the end of #29, there is a major continuity-changing event.
There's a three-year time gap between #29 and #30, and when we come back, things are not the same; thus this is a great place for new readers to start, because they'll be just as confused as new arrival Jex. Also: contains our first look at Highpoint.
There's a three-year time gap between #29 and #30, and when we come back, things are not the same; thus this is a great place for new readers to start, because they'll be just as confused as new arrival Jex. Also: contains our first look at Highpoint.
We introduce a villain (but is she?) with a very different set of motivations. And then we crash.
This one could have been called "Melinda" with equal justification. Fasten your seatbelts.
Strange phenomena, backstory maintenance, Coldpoint ... and an escape.
A standalone adventure with Ruby and Chapman in an unpleasant scenario. Seriously, this one's rough.
Contains a great deal of weirdness. Does not actually contain Melinda.
We get inklings that things are kind of coming apart, and also solve the mystery of Judith Barker.
Breakups, Barkers, bitterness ... and That Page of Genealogy.
In which we finally deal with the Anomaly Patrol and the bee women.
In which Ruby and Leyna go someplace we've only ever seen once before.
Everything from #20 through #29 -- a year's worth of issues -- was, unusually for me, plotted roughly all at once. Here we begin a set of plots which will send us hurtling toward the event at the end of #29. You probably don't want to start in the middle of these, in other words.
See the commment below at #18.
As the titles imply, this is a two-parter; part 2 picks up right where part 1 leaves off and does not stop to recap. This story takes place in an extremely strange location and you're supposed to need a while to figure out what's going on.
As the title suggests, this is mostly about cleaning up the mess from #14-#16.
See the comment below at #14. All three of these issues suffer from overreach -- I didn't have enough tools to do the special effects the way I wanted and the lighting is sometimes not good -- but this one especially has problems, where it's often hard to figure out what's happening.
See the comment below at #14.
#14 through #16 are a three-part story ("Sleepless"); each one ends with a cliffhanger (after a fashion) and each picks up right where the previous one leaves off, without my stopping to explain or recap. These involve a major shakeup in the fabric of A4 and have lasting consequences.
"The Fisher Case" is a complete anomaly. It isn't really a Sleeper Squad story at all. It is a 1930's film-noir hard-boiled detective movie, and you do not have to know a damned thing about the rest of the Sleeper Squad goings-on to read it and enjoy it.
"Bliss" is the first of these I can look at and say that the bones were fully in place, so to speak. It's the first one where I really felt I had finally gotten everything more or less right. It also begins with an "Our Story So Far" recap (the last gasp of Ruby's narration). For these reasons, if you don't want to start all the way at the beginning, this is a fine issue to begin on.
See the comment below at #10.
#10 and #11 are essentially a single story. This is a major transition point, where a particular villain cements her "most evil to date" status, and a number of plotbunnies finally crumble into dust.
Another unusual one, this is more or less a standalone murder mystery, though it does also have bits of backstory maintenance. This one was somewhat hampered by my not yet having the special effects to do it properly, but the story holds up well despite that.
Mostly concerned with the aftermath of the events in #7. A two-page bonus, "Doubling Down," was posted a few days later; it doesn't have a PDF, but the images are linked above as pages D1 and D2.
A major dose of villainy from a character of later high plot significance.
This was supposed to be more or less a standalone, apart from introducing us to the Souk, but it has turned out to have been of great significance in terms of characters we see much more of later. Visually, this issue was a serious disappointment to me; see About the Comics for remarks on why.
Introduction of a major villain, and the first story to really exploit the hallucinatory possibilities of Sleep. There's one or two effects I'm not happy with, but on the whole this holds up well.
This should have been one issue. At the time I thought the stories should run about eight pages, and thus this one needed to be split. (These days, of course, a sixteen-page issue is a short one.) Anyway, if you read the PDFs you'll need two of them; if you use the individual images, I've numbered the pages as if they were a single issue. See About the Comics for some remarks on this issue.
Introduction of a character whose evolution later could not possibly have been predicted at this point by anyone, not even me.
This story has been remade.
None of the other early issues have been redone in this way, and very likely never will be, but in this case there were sound reasons. The version you see here was created and posted in November 2022; the date above is the date of the original version. For more on why I remade it, and the issues with the early issues in general, see About the Comics.
None of the other early issues have been redone in this way, and very likely never will be, but in this case there were sound reasons. The version you see here was created and posted in November 2022; the date above is the date of the original version. For more on why I remade it, and the issues with the early issues in general, see About the Comics.
Quitclaim
The Quitclaim stories are the adventures of a woman with an unusual profession, as she wanders a galaxy that may well be ours, just in the distant future. Or it may be an alternate version of ours. Who knows?
I try to make these as standalone as possible; Randa Guerrero, our hero and narrator, has backstory and we get occasional glimpses of it, but I want you to be able to pick up any of these stories at random and enjoy it without feeling like you needed to read any of the others to understand what was going on. Whether I've succeeded at that is an open question.
These are detective procedurals at heart: Randa gets entangled in a situation, has to untangle it (solve a crime, fix a problem, etc), and flies off at the end in her ship Bosie, leaving everyone asking "who was that masked lesbian?" The detective procedural is my first love, and it pains me that they don't connect with more readers. Anyway, Quitclaim, even more than the other categories of stories on this page, are stories for me -- the stories I not only want to tell, but want to read. (However, these stories are also hard to plot, and this is one reason there aren't many of them.)
If you have read my novel THE RING, published under another name, note that this is sort of the same fictional universe as that book. I've kept some elements, discarded others, added new ones, and changed the way some things work. For example, the Rings in this universe don't have their own docks or living space on them; those things are in nearby ships and structures, thus busy Rings almost always have a little "neighborhood" of ships and stations and repowering sites and repair sites and so forth around them.
Quitclaim stories have a couple of notable faults I'm still working on. They tend to be very narration-heavy, especially at the beginnings of stories as Randa explains How We Got There, and space scenes continue to be a problem because they are nearly impossible to light well and it's hard to tell what's going on. You have been warned.
CONTENT NOTE: Randa has sex with someone in most Quitclaim stories. It's usually pretty discreet (one or two panels of two naked women in bed). There are a couple of moments of violence, and one story has a scene which is fairly gruesome. There is also a fair bit of matter-of-fact nudity simply because Randa prefers to wear as few clothes as possible when in private.
Randa must track down and deal with a Figure From Her Past.
Randa travels to the ocean planet Btheria to investigate the disappearance of a survey mission. There may or may not be sea monsters.
Randa must figure out what the heck actually happened on Hurch 3, when she really just wants a good long soak in a pool.
Randa must learn the truth behind an extremely popular virtual performer and the people who control her.
Randa has to find a missing person on a planet that's supposed to be empty, and isn't quite.
Randa ends up on a twisty path involving a murder, a crime syndicate, and various non-humans who don't like each other much.
Randa investigates an illicit research station where apparently the research did not go as planned.
Randa investigates some disappearances on a frontier planet which, if not solved, could have major consequences.
Randa goes to investigate a new settlement that hasn't checked in and finds out that not only has it not checked in, there's no sign it ever existed.
Randa runs into (almost literally) an unregistered space station and investigates it. This story is an anomaly in many ways. In fact, I wouldn't recommend starting with it. (Try "The Cold Front" first.) For more on this, see About the Comics.
Coldpoint
The Coldpoint stories are set in the distant extraplanetary settlement of the same name, where people emigrate to have their minds transferred into robot bodies, after which they will live out the remainder of their (possibly infinite) lives happily that way. But not all is peace and bliss on Coldpoint; these stories are, once again, detective procedurals, and unlike Quitclaim, the event being investigated is always a murder.
Unlike the other series here, Coldpoint is not intended to be open-ended. There's a fixed story arc planned, which is being developed slowly; I anticipate somewhere between eight to ten stories in all. This slow development does mean that these stories are best read in order; though the events in each stand alone, the political situation in Coldpoint mutates gradually, and that informs those events.
CONTENT NOTE: Yeah, there's sex. Violence, too, though I try to be discreet.
The one with the death backstage at the theatre.
The one with the bad batch of beer.
The one with the robot dropped down the airshaft.
Tales From The Reality Next Door
These stories were not originally intended to intersect. They just all happened to be set in the same universe -- an alternate version of our own, mostly the same but with notably different technological advancement -- and, in fact, in the same city. But they insisted on overlapping. Characters recur from story to story and sometimes even interact with one another. Despite that, these stories mostly can each stand alone. There are a few places where your reading of one will be enriched by having read one of the others.
As I note on AO3: "These stories tend to deal even more heavily with gender and identity changes than my other stuff, which is really saying something."
The one story in the set to date which has not really interacted with the others is the first one, "Utilidolls." "Utilidolls" was an excuse for an extended transformation sequence, and unlike the others, barely has a story. But I have plans to bring its continuity into collision with the others. Watch this space. Anyway, "Utilidolls" is anomalous; if any one story here represents the overall themes best, it's "Bioproxy" (which, by the way, may be my favorite of all the "comics" I've done, with "ReVamp" a close second).
CONTENT NOTE: Plenty of sex. It's important. You could not have these stories without sex. (And frankly, the sex is often the hook to get these stories to people. See About the Comics.)
Vanessa Salkind temporarily needs another body. It may not turn out the way she wants.
Don Harlow's usual Saturday night poker game has a very unusual set of rules.
Kyle becomes increasingly fascinated with Brenda and what makes her what she is. He gets into the puzzle more deeply than he had planned.
Jer and Greg go to a convention where they experience some unwelcome changes that turn out not to be all that unwelcome after all -- complications notwithstanding.
Have you wanted to be someone else? We can put you in a different body. It'll cost you, though. Maybe in ways you didn't anticipate.
As I note at left, this story is anomalous and not representative of the others. Brent is investigating mysterious disappearances. He gets a lot closer to the answer than he wanted.
T--'s True Tales of Transformation
The reason for the omitted name in the title is that these are "Trilby's True Tales of Transformation" any time of the year except Christmas, when Trilby defers to Tinseltop, a Christmas elf, and they become "Tinseltop's True Tales of Transformation." Trilby is my alter ego; there is an image of her at the top of this page. If you look closely you will notice that all of the "comic" style stories are credited to her. I am she and she is me.
This is not really a series. Let's call it a "category." What happens is that sometimes I feel the need to do some gender-change or transformation kinkfluff, particularly as a breather after Sleeper Squad, and sometimes a holiday is a great excuse for it. I did a very crude transformation story called "Guidance" back in December 2020 that was Christmas-themed (it's not linked here, but in About the Comics you can learn about its significance,and maybe find directions to it), and another Christmas story that same year called "Regifting" which was explicitly framed as being "told" by Tinseltop.
I then did another story in February 2021 which was Valentine's-themed, and one in April 2021 which was not really Easter-themed except in that it involved bunnies (of the cocktail-waitress variety). But they did not formally become TTTT stories until October 2021, when I had burned out on the sprint of doing three Sleeper Squad issues (#14-#16) in five weeks, and needed to flee as far from that as I could for a month, and did two Hallowe'en stories with very different tones. I also did two Christmas stories in December of that year where we finally got to see Tinseltop, and from then on we were truly off and running.
Important holidays for TTTT (and these stories must always be at least vaguely holiday-themed to qualify for the category) are Hallowe'en and Christmas. Valentine's Day is a close third; I've run out of good stories for Easter, though. I keep trying to think of other holidays that can get this treatment. I have considered St. Patrick's Day, but I hate that particular mess of cliches and shamrock passionately, and I haven't found a good hook for Independence Day yet. I also have one for Mother's Day I haven't yet dared do.
CONTENT NOTE: This is kinkfluff. Does it have sex? What do you think? (In fact, two of these stories contain two of the very rare occasions when I have had to use a censor blot on a story to post it on DA.)
Not so much with the kinkfluff this time, two of the three stories in this anthology are my attempt to be genuinely unnerving and/or gross. The other is unexpectedly sweet.
A rush job because I didn't decide I wanted to do one until the Wednesday before Easter (and wanted it out by Sunday, obviously).
I thought I had run out of riffs on this idea once I did MTWYD 2, but apparently I was mistaken. This apparently takes place in the same college as "Bad Hare Day," because we see the characters from that in the lecture hall.
Any resemblance between the villain in this piece and any real-world individual is probably just your imagination. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
This may be one of the nerdiest stories I've ever done (which is saying a lot), but oh, I can't tell you how much I enjoyed throwing in those old-school D&D jokes. "Cure Moderate Death" still makes me snortlaugh every time I reread this. This one is an Epic; the longest non-Sleeper Squad comic I've done to date. Sit back and enjoy the ride.
Wordless comics are surprisingly hard to do (at least for me). This one came out pretty good, I think.
I wanted to do this one without real dialogue the way I had done the first one, but I couldn't make it work.
Doesn't have anything to do with actual Boxing Day except that it takes place over the course of a day, more or less, and things get put into boxes.
Bonus story. Wordless, but there's a certain song playing in the background ... There was actually a second bonus story this year, called "Be a Deer and Help Us Out," which is not provided here and you're not missing much.
Five short stories, interspersed with bits of autobiographical material about my kink influences. I expected the latter part would put people off, and it probably did, but not much; this story has done very well in views on both DA and AO3. After this came out, a reader expressed regret that there was no TG content in here anywhere, and also there were some aspects of "Videodrones" that I felt needed a little elaboration; so a few days later I posted an add-on story, "Altered Status," which is the 'AS' page in the image list above.
As I said on AO3 at the time: This piece of fluff is utterly without redeeming social importance, but it does have a lot of sex. There is one panel in this story that makes me laugh every single time, but I'm not telling anybody what it is.
Meet the Woman of Your Dreams Valentine's Day 2022
Three pages is on the edge of where I'd choose to make a PDF version, and I did not. This story is basically wordless, and here that means the action, especially in the house-of-mirrors sequence, is a bit hard to make out ... but it's not really important (the money shot is the "HERE SHE IS" panel) and I think the essentials all come across OK.
See remarks just below.
"Bad Boys Get Switches" is a relatively lighthearted lark with Tinseltop. "Shop of Little Horrors" is much darker in tone, longer, more technically complex, and Tinseltop isn't in it at all after the intro. Pay your money and take your choice. Better yet, read both.
See remarks just below.
"Peril of the Pink Perfume" and "24 Hour People Party" were released within four days of each other. (That seems unlikely now; I think I must have deliberately sat on the release for one of them.) Unlike the two Christmas stories to come later that year, this time the darker, longer, creepier one was released first.
The fact that this had, when last checked, over thirteen thousand views on DA proves that kink will always triumph over quality (unfortunately).
I hadn't attempted a wordless comic before this. The giant speech and thought bubbles on the first two pages don't really work. But it doesn't matter because no one reads this story for anything but page 3.
Other Fiction, Old and New
I hardly ever write fiction in prose form anymore. The reasons are given in the About the Comics page.
What you have in this section, arranged as reverse-chronologically as I can deduce, are:
- "Comic" format stories that do not fit any of the sections above;
- Prose fiction which I have posted to AO3 over the years;
- A few strays from my old/other websites I have seen fit to keep around.
- "Comic" format stories that do not fit any of the sections above;
- Prose fiction which I have posted to AO3 over the years;
- A few strays from my old/other websites I have seen fit to keep around.
New material added to the top of this list is, at least in my present state of mind, ninety-eight percent likely to be in comic format. I mean, it's always possible that you will one day come here to find that a new piece of prose fiction has been added to the top of the list. But don't hold your breath. On the other hand, it's very possible I'll add an old piece of fiction to the top of the list, unearthed and dusted off, in which case I'll be clear about the dates so you'll know everything old is new again.
Several of these stories come with latter-day notes (on the story pages themselves, not here in the listing), because time makes fools of us all.
CONTENT NOTE: Could be anything. One of these stories has some of the most explicit sex I've ever written. Others are squeaky clean.
This piece, which was written in 2024 as we were all coming to grips with the impending end of democracy in the United States, is set in a world a little too close to comfort to our own. Contains some really mercenary sex and some nasty transformations. Also, it's multiple-choice. You have been warned.
This story is sweet, good-natured, clean, and surprisingly reality-based for a plot involving ghostly possession. I'm not sure what got into me. Neither is Luis.
This is not a story about Barbie dolls. It is not a story about Barbie dolls because nowhere is safe from Mattel's rabid attack lawyers. It is, however, a story about a family, a transformation, and some dolls which happen to be quite similar to Barbie dolls ...
Full title: "I Fell In Love With A Mind-Controlling, Body-Altering Alien From System 52U7." Caution: not nearly as fluffy as it sounds. A few remarks on this one are in About the Comics.
This is the way the world ends: not with a whimper, but a bang.
DA's lousy stats system makes it hard to tell, but I believe this is my most-viewed and most-favorited comic-format post there (so far). I have some remarks on that in About the Comics.
I seldom do outright parody, partly because I'm not very good at it, but mostly because it depends on the reader being familiar with the thing being parodied. Not all of my readers will be, in this particular case. (NOTE: This story bears absolutely no resemblance whatsoever to any of the intellectual property of BioWare and/or whatever fifty thousand parent companies own them this week.)
This was a light-relief story I did in a hurry after the ordeal of "The Dead Drop." Like several other relief-fluff stories I've done, it has no actual dialogue. It also has almost no actual plot. All you need to know is in the title.
TGTF fluff. No warranties. (Actually, I have a few remarks which you can find in About the Comics.)
A tale about why you shouldn't mix sex and time travel. Or, perhaps, why you should. I enjoy this piece a lot, possibly because I think I successfully made it light and breezy despite a plot which actually took some on-paper diagramming to work out.
This is me playing with a couple of particular smut tropes, and there are some remarks and a disclaimer, but you can't miss them; Trilby makes them at the beginning of the story.
Detective Green 2017
This is actually two stories, and they have problems. Read the remarks on the page.
The Unwanted Alibi November 2019
There are only two suspects for the murder of Richard Carter. Neither of them has an alibi, but only one of them is deliberately trying to avoid having one. Everyone realizes that must be important, but only Nero Wolfe manages to figure out why.
Honey West in: The Case of the Jaguar's Wife January 2019
Honey West stumbles onto the trail of a mysterious woman who may or may not be responsible for a set of strange circumstances.
Home For the Holidays December 2015
My most notorious piece of fiction. No, seriously. (And there's not even sex in it!)
In the Shadows of Mount Washington, Nightly October 2015
After dark, in a Pittsburgh possibly not too far removed from this one ...
Murder With Mistletoe September 2015
A woman is murdered after having dinner at Nero Wolfe's house. The solution is obvious. But what does the mistletoe have to do with it? And what on earth inspired Fritz to put it on the table in the first place?
Schiphol, 1969 February 2015
Tara King goes on holiday and meets someone she was not expecting to encounter.
A horror vignette, of the "creepy" rather than "gruesome" school.
Ernst Eternal August 2010
A short-short that does not contain James Bond.
The Vanishing Girl February 2006
Some stories you write and you realize you might not ever approach anything that good again.
Codependence February 1999
A short-short, and the oldest thing that will make it onto these pages without substantial revision.
Auntie Col's Attic
I have a substance abuse problem. I am addicted to words. I have been since I was about seven years old.
Every so often, apropos of nothing, I just need to toss out a few thousand reasonably well-formed words. Fiction, non-fiction, doesn't matter; I just need to write something. Sometimes I just want to braindump on random topics. Sometimes I rant. It could be anything. I need a place to put it.
I also have an enormous pile of fragments and wreckage from the personal web sites I've run in some form or another since 1993, back when the web was small. Their bones surround me. Once in a while I get ambitious and dredge out something from the pile and dust it off and patch the cracks, and if I do, perhaps it will appear here.
Everything in this section of the page is non-fiction. Fiction goes in the sections above. If a piece here contains snippets of fiction, it is only so I can wrap it with non-fiction commentary. Apart from that, there is no telling what the fuck will be in this section. As I am writing this introductory text, I have utterly no idea myself.
The bottom piece "About the Comics" is the the "documentation" for this website, and contains important tips for reading these stories (for example, why "100%" isn't).
The War on Creativity and How We Got Here 3 October 2024
Why capitalism will never value art, and who's learned the wrong lessons ... and how generative art is, on balance, making the situation worse.
On Being a Smut Writer in the Siege Years 2 October 2024
Why conditions are horrible for smut, why you should care, and why I'm willing to claim to be a pornographer even though I'm actually not.
About the "Comics" (and Why I Do It) 1 October 2024
And why the word "comics" is in quotes. Includes the history of how I turned down this weird alley, if you care.